Today, most NATO militaries use sidearms chambered for the 9×19mm Parabellum cartridge, but the effectiveness of the .45 ACP cartridge has ensured its continued popularity with large caliber sport shooters, especially in the United States. If you like your 45s, and more importantly, can hit with it, go for it. [19] In 1985, the .45 ACP M1911A1 pistol was replaced by the Beretta M9 9mm pistol as the main sidearm of the U.S. military, although select Special Operations units continue to use the M1911A1 or other .45 ACP pistols. What you see is what you get here. With same ammo my .45 SHIELD, Colt 1911 5-inch, S&W 625-8 4-inch and Para Ordinance PC12 3.5-inch ALL recoil about the same! The traditional arguments still prevail in some ways. In the case of the .45 ACP, the new standard cartridge pressure is 21,000 psi (140 MPa) and the SAAMI .45 ACP +P standard is 23,000 psi (160 MPa). Some 45 ACP loads show all the velocity we could ask for. Now retired, I upgraded to a FNHUSA FNX-45 Tactical with a LWI muzzle brake. Or does that add too many variables? I really don’t care if is heavy. And if my life and the life of those I love is in the gun I carry Round Nose Full Metal Jacket: Case. [16][17][18] While high capacity firearms are available in .45 ACP, the greater length and diameter of the .45 ACP means that the grip of the pistol must be longer and wider than the grip of a comparable pistol of a smaller caliber; this increase in grip size can make the pistol difficult to use for shooters with smaller hands. I would go so far as to say that in terms of functional lethality, the short 3.3” barrel loses nothing to the longer barrels. Excess velocity just creates recoil and muzzle blast. This is a common practice for updating older cartridges to match the better quality of materials and workmanship in modern firearms.[19]. Range / Target: Muzzle Velocity. I agree with Ya Mamma. SAAMI specifications for 45 acp. Going to sell my full size 45’s. A longer barrel will ALWAYS produce higher muzzle velocity regardless of which s&w m&p is ur bff. “Accuracy” and follow up shots in a gunfight is really up to the shooter’s abilities. [21], Most ammunition manufacturers also market what are termed "+P" (pronounced "plus P", designating overpressure ammunition) loadings in pistol ammunition, including the .45 ACP. Muzzle Energy. The Shield loses in no areas in my mind. The countertop became a courtroom of sorts and I found myself in the middle of a caliber war, this time about the merits of the .45 ACP. I’ve chronied 230 gr. Colt / .45 AC (Winchester Repeating Arms Company), This page was last edited on 18 December 2020, at 13:41. Cheap Ammo, In Stock Ammunition For Sale & Bulk Ammo. 45-70" 4 ammo to get the id number. This experience, and the Thompson–LaGarde Tests of 1904, led the Army and the Cavalry to decide a minimum of .45 caliber was required in a new handgun. Thing is that it isn’t really supposed to be. The .45 ACP is regarded as a top self-defense round in terms of stopping power and recoil. ARCHIVED; Armory » Reloading. The .45 is a fine caliber for a variety of tasks today. The ammunition I received ranged from simple ball loads to exotic self-defense rounds that could easily be called art due to the quality of their machining. doubled in size…and since .45 ACP is bigger to start with, it became massive in the end. 45 ACP velocity testing considering that it is shorter than most people think a .45 ACP handgun should be. To equal the impact of a .45 ACP bullet, the 1-pound weight needs a velocity of 27.1 fps and must be dropped from a height of 11.4 feet. I taught quite a few classes in the Hudson Valley NY area, generally Federal, State and/or Municipal LE Agencies. BE. Call us at (540) 898-9256, If you have questions. There is also a reduced likelihood of overpenetration, meaning that it is more likely that the projectile will transfer all of its kinetic energy to the intended target, thus more reliably incapacitating them. The Rowland operates at a developer established 40,000 psi (280 MPa) SAAMI and may only be used within a select group of firearms significantly modified for this purpose; the Rowland case is 0.057 inches (1.4 mm) longer specifically to prevent it from being chambered in standard .45 ACP firearms. 45 ACP velocity adventure, I was imagining that there would be a large difference between the standard 5” barrel and the short 3.3” on the S&W Shield. I am currently using an H&G 68 clone and it seems to work fine. The larger guns are easier to aim due to a longer sight radius, but they suffer from a weight penalty and low capacity for their size. Compare all 45 ACP ammunition … The cartridge also comes in various specialty rounds of varying weights and performance levels.[2]. In its non-expanding full metal jacket (FMJ) version, the .45 ACP cartridge has a reputation for effectiveness against human targets because its heavy mass has the capacity to penetrate tissue deeply and damage the central nervous system, and its large 11.5mm diameter creates a more substantial permanent wound channel than other calibers, which can lower blood pressure rapidly if critical organs of the circulatory system are hit. When I began this . But I carry a 9MM Shield because of the load out, and the size and weight. The standard issue military .45 ACP round has a 230-grain bullet that travels at approximately 830 feet per second when fired from the government issue M1911A1 pistol. Therefore it makes logistical sense that velocity lost it shorter barrels is quite small compared to other calibers. .45 ACP maximum C.I.P. The cartridge expands to an average of 0.75” inches, but the Remington FMJ expands to 0.45”. The cartridge/pistol combination was quite successful but not satisfactory for U.S. military purposes. And if you run into that sentiment, you will usually find an argument against it following soon after. Will I carry the dam thing around for the next 20 years on the off chance I might need it. Today, AR-style weapons are available in 9-millimeter, 10-millimeter, .45 ACP, .40. I found that the truth lies somewhere in the middle of these points of view based on my results. Bottom line, the .45 ACP is the better self-defense cartridge, and does its best work at standard velocity. Today, most NATO militaries use sidearms chambered for the 9×19mm Parabellum cartridge, but the effectiveness of the .45 ACP cartridge has ensured its continued popularity with large caliber sport shooters, especially in the United States. Most .45 suppressors must be fired "wet" (with an ablative medium, usually oil or water) to bring sound levels down to "hearing-safe" (under 140 dB, generally).[20]. After successful military trials, it was adopted as the standard chambering for Colt's M1911 pistol. The .45 ACP is an effective combat pistol cartridge that combines accuracy and stopping power for use against human targets. They noted, however, training was critical to make sure a soldier could score a hit in a vulnerable part of the body. Slow fire is at reduces 50 yard targets at 25 yards. The minute variances were not even outside of standard deviation. The .45 ACP (11.43×23mm) (Automatic Colt Pistol), also known as the .45 Auto by C.I.P. ‪I’m a statistician. The first production, at Frankford Arsenal, was marked "F A 8 11", for the August 1911 date. The downside to the use of .45 ACP in suppressed weapons is that increasing the diameter of the passage through a suppressor decreases the suppressor's efficiency; thus, while .45 ACP is among the most powerful suppressed pistol rounds, it is also one of the loudest. Every load and weapon tested are currently commercially available and unaltered from their factory form. This means that .45 ACP chambered arms in C.I.P. Most quality bullets, in all the defensive handgun calibers are designed to work(expand) at a fairly wide… Read more ». You are wrong however about the 9mm. But many modern pistols have adopted the cartridge into double-stacked magazine designs, though this increases the pistol's width. Overall, it appears the .45 Auto is slightly faster in comparable products, but shooters will not see a significant difference between the two. Another area to address is velocity. Probably not. This means the cartridge is loaded to a higher maximum pressure level than the original SAAMI cartridge standard, generating higher velocity and more muzzle energy. .45 Automatic Pistol Ball Cartridge, Model of 1911", a 1.273 in (32.3 mm) long round with a bullet weight of 230 grains (15 g). 543 ft. lbs. Even my teenage granddaughters enjoy shooting it. The 10mm Auto is a intriguing round in he handgun world. A sharp eye will notice that virtually all 230gr forty five ball loads are still nearly identical to the old 800fps standard going back to the First World War with some being slower yet. AR15.COM is the world’s largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types. If anybody has a PC Shield in .45 they want to sell contact me cause given the choice of a 9MM Shield and a .45 Shield I’ll take the bigger bullet, going slower… Read more », You talk about the 3.3″ barrel is too short for the 45 ACP, but I carry a S&W Pro Series 1911 and it has a 3″ barrel. You will discover velocity increases in these longer barrels is actually quite minimal, compared to other calibers. However, there are occasions when the shorter .45 ACP tubes produce greater velocity than the longer barrels. 230 Grains: Bullet Type. Many often wonder about the difference between 45 Colt vs. 45 ACP ammo – the former was a heavy, fast-moving bullet at 255 gr and 900+ fps, and was vital in settling and civilizing the American West. Yes sir, AZDPS. The colder temperature allows the guns to remain cool between strings and remove error due to the weapon heating up. These cartridges have the same external dimensions as the standard-pressure cartridges and will chamber and fire in all firearms designed for the standard-pressure loadings. After the poor performance of the Army's .38 Long Colt pistols evidenced during the Philippine–American War (1899–1902), Thompson insisted on a more capable pistol cartridge.[9]. The results proved interesting to say the least. 50 Round Box. It has relatively low muzzle blast and flash, and it produces a stout, but manageable recoil in handguns, made worse in compact models. In fact, standard pressure 230 grain FMJ loads are, perhaps, the .45 owner’s best choice for bears since they penetrate deep and make wider wounds than non-expanding 10mm’s. To get a picture of the modern .45 ACP's velocity, I contacted several manufacturers and received 33 ammunition offerings to test. In the second round of evaluations in 1910, the Colt design passed the extensive testing with no failures, while the Savage design suffered 37 stoppages or parts failures. Ron, where were you a LEO carrying a P220? This is a video of … During the late 19th century and early 20th century, the U.S. Cavalry began trials to replace their sidearm arsenal of issued .45 Colt Single Action Army (SAA) in favor of the more modern and versatile double-action revolver in .45 Colt. PMC is a pretty run of the mill cartridge manufacturer and the FMJ's bullet won't muck with the trajectory and velocity. In a remarkable display of performance, the Lehigh Defense ( ) .120gr load had a variance of only 29fps across the average velocities from all four barrels! DWM, which submitted two Parabellums chambered in .45 ACP, withdrew from testing after the first round of tests, for unspecified reasons.[8]. Basically, if your second, third, 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th, etcetera, shots cannot be on target, the concept of how fast those rounds are… Read more ». 45 ACP +P 45 ACP +P Ammo - 185 gr. I believe the year was 1989. After the example of the Cavalry, the Army in turn had fielded versions of double-action revolvers in .38 Long Colt. In tests against ballistic gelatin, a 185 grain hollow point traveling at 1,050 feet per second expanded to about .76 inches. Interesting results, especially with the shorter barrel. I love mine and my 357s and 9mms and 10mms and 44s and…….. Joe Your right about the .45 ACP. Josh Wayner has been writing in the gun industry for five years. Cheaper: To convert an AR-15 to a .45 ACP chambering costs over $700 on top of the purchase of the AR-15. The original round that passed the testing fired a 200 grain (13 g) bullet at 900 ft/s (275 m/s), but after a number of rounds of revisions between Winchester Repeating Arms, Frankford Arsenal, and Union Metallic Cartridge, it ended up using a 230 grain (14.9 g) bullet fired at a nominal velocity of 850 ft/s (260 m/s). Colt had been working with Browning on a .41 caliber cartridge in 1904, and in 1905, when the Cavalry asked for a .45 caliber equivalent, Colt modified the pistol design to fire an enlarged version of the prototype .41 round. Does it matter in terms of terminal performance within reasonably defensible distances? A .45 averages about 11.3”-14.3” penetration. NO WAY. The latter inevitably produce a highly compressed shock wave, audible as a loud "crack", a small sonic boom, while they travel through the air. The Super provides approximately 20% greater velocity than the .45 ACP +P; the Rowland approximately 40% greater velocity than the .45 ACP +P. Out of the box I considered it to be the finest DA/SA pistol I’d fired in the caliber. [citation needed] Hollow-point rounds intended for maximum effectiveness against live targets are designed to expand upon impact with soft tissue, increasing the size of the permanent cavity left by the bullet as it passes through the target. I detected no significant velocity shift in the loads tested with any pistols. I carry it cocked and locked, does not print, easy to draw, excellent for CQ, I… Read more », Pointing to the author’s fixation with speed, speed, speed, I call his speed, speed, speed, bet, and raise him the Big A: Accuracy, Accuracy, Accuracy!!! The .45 ACP also operates at a relatively low maximum chamber pressure rating of 21,000 psi (145 MPa) (compared to 35,000 psi/240 MPa for 9mm Parabellum and .40 S&W, 37,500 psi/260 MPa for 10mm Auto, 40,000 psi/280 MPa for .357 SIG), which due to a low bolt thrusthelps extend service life of … Limit 1 Unit, What “Unsigning” the Arms Trade Treaty Means for American Gun Owners ~ VIDEO, Gun Deals: Smith & Wesson M&P15-22 Sport 22LR 16.5″ $429.99 FREE S&H, The “Other” Model ’94 Lever Action Rifle: Marlin 94 Rifle, Second Amendment Makes Clear: Americans Are Not Subservient To Government – Part Two, Arkansas Passes Significant NFA Gun Law Reforms in 2019, American Eagle :, Black Hills Ammunition :, Blazer Ammo :, Buffalo Bore Ammunition :, Federal Premium Ammunition :, Hornady Manufacturing :, Lehigh Defense :, SIG SAUER Ammunition :, Speer Ammo : 9mm Ballistics. or 45 Auto by SAAMI, is a cartridge designed by John Browning in 1904, for use in his prototype Colt semi-automatic .45 pistol and eventually the M1911 pistol adopted by the United States Army in 1911. So if low velocity and low round count are bad, then the pmr30 would be pretty close to ideal. I taught a class in Bristol, Pa. One… Read more », My Shield 45 is a tack driver. 45 ACP is very similar, with a 230 grain (gr) lead bullet that travels at an impressive 830 feet per second (fps). Is it the most effective cartridge available today? #OldCowboy, In this case, the .45 Colt has a muzzle velocity of 860, while the .45 Auto has a muzzle velocity of 890. First state agency to authorize and issue SIGs. Traded for it in ‘Nam, the ARVN were still using WW11 weapons at the time, my rifle jammed, the .45 did not. I enjoyed it. [2] The round was developed due to a lack of stopping power experienced in the Moro Rebellion using the .38 Long Colt. Complete 45 ACP ammunition ballistics Chart. Other US military cartridges include: tracer M26 (red tip), blank M1921 (rolled crimp, red paper wad), M12 and M15 shot shells, and M9 dummy (holes in case). Drawbacks for military use include the cartridge's large size, weight, increased material costs in comparison to the smaller, flatter shooting NATO standard 9×19mm Parabellum cartridge, which uses less powder, brass, and lead per round. AZ perhaps. The .45 ACP is an inherently subsonic cartridge that’s designed for optimum performance at those lower speeds. The small size (comparable to a Glock 43 Handgun) combined with no loss of ballistic efficiency make it a potent choice for fans of the .45 ACP. Tracer ammunition for the .45 ACP was manufactured by Frankford Arsenal and by Remington Arms. WHAT? My CCW is a Colt Commander, 10 rnd mag, I have put over 3500 rnds through it and it has not failed to function properly yet. Standard 9mm NATO ammunition has limited armor penetration capability − a deficiency with .45 ACP whose large, slow bullet does not penetrate armor to any great extent. The most unexpected thing aside from the general similarity of all loads across all barrel lengths was that the longest barrel wasn’t the fastest. It is my opinion that this caliber isn’t going anywhere anytime fast. This is a significantly large permanent wound cavity for a handgun projectile. The cartridge also has relatively low muzzle blast and flash, as well as moderate recoil. We offer choices of excellent quality range ammo, the most proven hollow points and specialty rounds in all of the most popular calibers. The .45 ACP handguns ranked last, largely due to increased recoil. The light self-defense loads are essentially comparable to 9mm of similar bullet weight while most heavier loads generate a much heavier amount of recoil than many shooters would find comfortable. I have five 1911s in barrel lengths from the 3″ to 5″ and the S&W is to me the most accurate. The weapon has the same capacity as the 1911 with seven or eight rounds onboard, but is less than half the weight. Sorry buddy but your statistics are flawed and biased. If +P loadings are used in firearms not specifically designed for them, they may cause damage to the weapon and injuries to the operator. Thompson and Major Louis Anatole La Garde of the Medical Corps arranged tests on cadavers and animal remains in the Chicago stockyards, resulting in the finding that .45 was the most effective pistol cartridge. Tags: 45 acp 45 auto 45 cal geco ammunition full metal jacket. Mfg. While slightly decreasing penetration and likewise the chance of hitting a vital organ, a large diameter wound will cause more blood loss. Period. The compiled .45 ACP velocity data points are an average of six (6) readings over the Oehler 35P. We also sell Ammo in bulk, so if you are looking to save money or stock up, consider our deals on Bulk Ammo. velocity is simply away of controlling bullet performance and getting that bullet to the target. In CIP-regulated countries every pistol cartridge combination has to be proofed at 130% of this maximum CIP pressure to certify for sale to consumers. Not Ron, but a great question Old Cowboy. Only DWM, Savage, and Colt made the first cut. Specialty rounds are available in weights under 100 grains (6.5 g) and over 260 grains (16.8 g); popular rounds among reloaders and target shooters include 185-grain and 230-grain (12 g and 15 g) bullets. [11] All dimensions are in inches (millimeter), The common rifling twist rate for this cartridge is 1 in 16 in (406 mm), 6 grooves, Ø lands = .442" (11.23 mm), Ø grooves = .45" (11.43 mm), land width = .147" (3.73 mm) and the primer type is large pistol. If you can’t ‘handle’ the recoil of a short barrel handgun, whether it be a .38, .357, 9mm, .40, or .45, that’s a whole different discussion – in which I don’t think the author set out to… Read more », Mr. Bailey, You are pretty much right on the money. I am here today thanks to a 1911 45 manufactured in 1917. Nice try tho my guy, Theoretically you are correct, as far as mid bore calibers are concerned. Testing was done using an Oehler 35P Proof Chronograph at a distance of five feet from the muzzle in a testing environment of 30 degrees Fahrenheit. .45 ACP loads use fast burning powders and for the most part full ignition takes place inside the barrels be they 3.3″ such as the Shield or 5″ such as the M1911 which is what I cut my teeth on in the Marine Corps beginning in 1966. Renewing for my carry license I was able to put Five rounds in a 1″ circle from 7′ as fast as I could pull the trigger, under Five seconds. UGH! By Josh Wayner That being said, I am not openly advocating this as a solution for everyone. With standard (not extended) single-stack magazines, pistols based on the 1911 design commonly hold 8 rounds or less. The low velocity and heavy weight of the .45 is great for striking large areas and creating large wounds. [14], Because of its large diameter and straight-walled design, the .45 ACP geometry is the highest power-per-pressure production, repeating round in existence. I have personally loaded for and tried various loads on a 45 ACP from barrels as short as 3 inches to as long as 18 inches and find velocity differences Quite minor. Popular derivative versions of the .45 ACP are .45 Super and .460 Rowland. [ARCHIVED THREAD] - .45 ACP Loads - Velocity and Bullet Types. Though he preferred the .45 ACP over the 9mm, the celebrated gun writer Jeff Cooper still wasn't satisfied with just those two choices. Does this data also apply to even shorter barrels, such as the 2.5″ charter arms pitbull .45 acp? The cartridge was designed by John Browning for Colt, but the most influential person in selecting the cartridge was Army Ordnance member Gen. John T. Thompson. The .45 has benefited from modern manufacturing processes and improved bullet technology. I recently bought a Ruger SR1911, VERY well made and VERY accurate. The other camp I often encounter and debate argues that the .45 ACP offers a profound advantage due to the bullet mass and ‘stopping power’ available, the adage being that one .45 is worth two or three ‘little nines’ in a fight. The cartridge expands to approximately 0.35 to 0.72”. USA –  -( I got into a discussion with several local gentlemen over last Christmas about things typical to those who frequent gun stores. It was eventually evaluated that the .38-caliber round was significantly less effective in overall stopping-power than the .45 Colt against determined opponents in cases such as the Moro juramentado warriors, who were encountered in the Moro Rebellion. Overview. After two years of testing, one of the final FBI comments was that services that adopt (or stay with) .40 S&W or .45 ACP did so at the risk of increased recoil and a possible reduction in accuracy as 9 x 19mm with premium quality ammunition had nearly exactly the same performance. The low muzzle velocity also makes the bullet drop over long ranges, making hits more difficult; however, it is important to note that the vast majority of self-defense situations involving handguns typically occur at close ranges. 45 acp 230 gr initial velocity is 830 (slightly slower than average 45 velocity), and the 9mm 124 gr initial velocity is 1110 (slightly slower than average 9mm velocity). It is, in my mind, best suited to single-stack carry pistols given the modern pistols like the Shield 45 that can tame it and lose nothing in the process. 45 ACP Muzzle Velocity. @ 1,150 fps/M.E. What ballistics aficionados tend to argue is “Stoppng Power” which is the ability of a round to stop your attacker. I was fortunate to have a small pile of different .45 pistols passing through at the time, so I tested actual velocity from a range of pistols from compact to full-size. I’m a fan of the .45. I wonder why the Blazer 230 grain aluminum and brass cased ammo is so slow? I have put hundreds of rounds of multiple weights and shapes through it, without a malfunction. It is a great cartridge. Doesn’t match what I have seen, but I have shot “identical” guns with “identical” rounds and seen a 75 fps difference between the two…. OldCowboy, the anti-gun former Constitution State aka Connecticut, the DES&PP aka CSP now carry the SIG P220 in .45ACP….. Glock was interested in the deal but CT does not allow their formerly owned(trade-in-guns) to be sold to the public…Glock refused to be told how to run their business…wonder what SIG did with the P229 .40SW that CSP traded in?